It is generally used similarly to “life goes on”. Even if with more pessimism about the fact that certain things don’t change (sometimes for good though).

It is still going to be a big deal for a few weeks though…

A very old one indeed. It’s never certain how conclaves will go.

In 4 years I have never (and will never) used any service from /e/. There is no vendor lock whatsoever. That’s fully optional.

Points 3, 4 and 5 in your list are moot IMHO.

Also

It takes a base level of understanding why you would buy a Fairphone

It doesn’t really. “Phone is repairable and X can help me”, “they pay the makers fair wages” are not really complex value propositions that require some (technical) understanding.

The point of /e/ and similar distributions is that you can buy a phone with it (average user will never reflash) and just have a phone that doesn’t use Google (it does, for the amount that doesn’t require you to do extra technical stuff and have a sane user experience at the same time).

That said, calyx seems a great alternative and so are iode. I think the advantages of one over the other (for my brief search) are quite small.

Gotcha, you are the classic person who is unnecessarily confrontational, but that dashes at any actual confrontation, because ultimately you have nothing to say. Your history shows this clearly.

We can all live without toxic people like you.

So your argument is repeating a cliché? OK.

I don’t need to convince you, but I explained my reasoning. Maybe make some practical examples, show some CVEs that - if left unpatched - severely impact the privacy (or the broader security) of the average users.

Also, as anybody who works in security knows, security is not a binary, and securing often means paying a price (in usability, in Euro, in comfort, in performance, whatever). In my mom’s threat model there is no the APT leveraging a 0 day to breach her worthless phone, there are opportunistic scammers who send her emails. There is also google and the like harvesting her data to sell her shit (hence a deGoogled phone with bootloader unlocked is more important than a Google phone with bootloader locked, for example).

In my threat model there might be some more resourceful attackers (because believe it or not, a financial org trusts me with securing their infra). However, as I also said, a much simpler and cheaper attack that recently has made the news is just to snatch the phone unlocked from my hands on the street, rather than exploiting an android CVE. This is why for example I have app pins for signal, email and everything that supports it, and I need to authenticate at every use. I also store all my TOTP on my yubikey, rather than keeping them on the phone (even with PIN), so my phone is not good as a 2FA device.

What you call blasé is actually just a way I personally assessed the risks and decided to invest accordingly. People whose threat model involve the bots who spam emails do not have to invest in security like if the NSA is after them. Updating android a month later is not going to be even a “low” risk for most people, especially if they adopt the much more important practice (IMHO) of not installing every shitty app under the sun. If you think otherwise, make concrete examples perhaps. Using a cliché is not really building your credibility here.

I definitely wait more than a week to update for example. The marginal security risk is completely irrelevant for me compared to the operational risk of a buggy update. N-1 is a common practice for updating software in fact, unless there is absolutely a great reason to upgrade.

Also, I want to be in your circle, because most people I know if the phone doesn’t update automatically they probably won’t even think of updating their phone (or their computer) at all.

For me the reason is simple, I don’t care about the advanced threats that would be mitigated by GrapheneOS enough to buy a pixel and migrate. I already own a FP3 and that’s what I am going to use until it breaks.

I might consider Graphene in the future, but having to buy a Google phone (even a used one) already pisses me off, compared to a FP (or similar). eOS also tries to be a “noob-friendly” distribution, that you can buy phones with and you never have to mess with the phones, which means people who don’t have the skills or don’t want to mess with their phones might trade the risk with ease of operation, and it might be the right choice for them.

Generally speaking privacy and security are related but not really linked to each other. Google services might be very secure, but a privacy nightmare for example. In this particular case, even more, because the chances that using a “googled” phone will mean data collection (I.e. privacy issues) are almost certain, while the risks we are talking about are much more niche and - as I elaborated on another comment - in my opinion not really in most people threat model.

I would like to hear your perspective instead, because I am not really into using authority arguments, but as a security engineer I believe to at least understand well the issue with security updates, vulnerabilities and exploits. So yes, I do think to know what I am talking about.

I am not dismissing it, I am saying that is not as big as you make it to be. Most users lag behind in updates anyway, besides using minimal and trusted applications, the outside exposure to exploitation is relatively small, for a device without a public address. I am not the one APTs are going to use the SMS no-click 0-day against.

Similarly for the bootloader issue. The kind of attacks mitigated by this are not in most people threat models. They just are not. As someone else wrote, it’s possible to relock the bootloader anyway with official builds (such as my FP3). But anyway, even for myself the chance that my phone gets modified by physical access without my knowledge is a fraction of a fraction compared to the chance that someone will snatch the phone in my hand while unlocked, for example (a recent pattern).

If these two issues are what prompts you to call a “security dumpster fire”, I would say we at least have very different risk perceptions.

FWIW, I have the FP3 for now more than 4 years. I have only replaced the battery 6 months ago. A case would have been extra waste (to produce the case itself) in my case, and probably will be trashed after as it might not fit the next phone.

No offense, but that’s not what a security dumpster fire is. Security updates are important, of course, but they are also not the biggest deal.

In fact, I bet that the vast majority of users (on Android or otherwise) are lagging way behind in updates anyway.

It was! Yes, back to the base camp I think I have drank almost a liter in one go! That tap was the most delicious thing in my life!

I can relate with your story as a fellow acrophobic (relatively mild…), and it reminded me of a similar but very different situation I lived.

I was on a holiday with friends, we were planning to do some canyoning. I scouted the path beforehand just not to get stuck, and everywhere I read that there are always alternative paths to jumps. The day before we make a hike, 700m of climb over 5km, steep as hell and in the evening my legs were butter (not sure if the same is for you, but the more I don’t feel my body in control, the more fear takes over).

Next day, we go canyoning and I could legit barely walk. I start the course already thirsty, and after almost 1h we were barely halfway. Having to climb and jump (small stuff) made me sweaty AF, I was completely dehidrated. At some point we reach a place and I clearly realize there is no way back. I am the last one of the group, tired and thirsty as fuck, we are all tied on a rope, and we are on top of a big boulder. There are 2 ways down: jump 10m or go down with the rope.

I have spent close to 10min on top talking to the guide, asking completely moronic questions, and I have 8 of them on video because my friend was just before me and filmed.

I ended up jumping, I figured that with the energy I had left, I would rather do something that takes 2s rather that rope myself down. I probably managed to do that just because I was that dehydrated and almost in a delirious state. I remember looking down the water and just the memory makes me dizzy. But the feeling of not having an option B (or C) is what really gets you, this is why I could relate with your story even though this is a completely different situation.

Fun fact, I ended up being the only one in my group to jump 10 meters, and now the memory is a mixed bag of emotions, but I will always have brag rights with my friends.

Edit: I added a picture of the jump as seen from top. It’s a screenshot from the infamous video.

The view from below maybe is more realistic…

Ahaha somehow I was thinking about the face and didn’t think about Fantozzi because of the pants.

Now I am curious, what are you referring to?

I am confused if this is a low effort trolling attempt or if people’s ideas are legitimately this easily swayed by internal propaganda.

Edit 2:. Loving. The down votes for a Taiwanese person explaining to a westerner what our actual opinions are. Why don’t you all westsplain to me how I should feel.

This is exactly what happens on every .ml or hexbear discussion when someone mentions Ukraine, BTW.

Maybe they are just getting started with learning programming, be kind.