Mayor-President of Spain’s North African enclave of Melilla Juan Jose Imbroda has called on Morocco to establish a 500-meter-wide neutral zone along the borders of both Melilla and the nearby Spanish North African enclave of Ceuta following a severe migrant surge targeting Ceuta
I did not say any of those things; and I do not agree with any of those things. Please, refrain from assuming I mean things I did not say.
I am not in any way legitimizing colonialism.
I brought forward my opinion and backed it up with the necessary information. I’m in no ways saying Spain has not been a colonial county, indeed it was.
Could you please explain in detail the reasons as to why you believe Ceuta and Melilla should be considered colonies? I may change my mind.
Because they were literally military outposts put on Africa by conquest, the fact it was 400 years ago and before the modern state of Morroco doesn’t change that.
You might not intent to, but you’re making excuses for why colonialism doesn’t count as colonialism, which is literally what every attempt to legitimize colonialist projects does.
The examples I picked are because litterally the same arguments are used:
If the people living there had a right to self-determination it would be more complicated, but we’ve seen on mainland Spain that the Spanish so not legally or practically believe in the concept.
Why do you think a European colonial power should get to keep it’s overseas conquests but you don’t expand the same courtesy to China or Israel?
The fact that it happened 400 years ago and that it happened by conquest after centuries of fighting with the opposing country does change things for me.
I am not Spanish and I will fight Spanish people when they say south America was not a colony; but I completely see reason as to why that is not a colony.
Otherwise, most countries except less than about 10 around the world should be considered colonizers since they conquered lands from other countries.
So how long is long enough that colonized people should give up?
You could literally say the same thing about Palestine:
What about indigenous Americans? Should they abandon their claims because it was over 400 years ago?
They should, everyone should have a right to self determination.
I’m not arguing that colonization after some time stops being colonization.
I’m asking why do you believe Ceuta and Melilla are examples of colonization.
I agree on the right of self determination, for what I know people from Ceuta and Melilla do not want to leave Spain.
Other parts of Spain do and it is a pity they’re not allowed, even though to be fair the Basque county is pretty much as independent as a region of a country could be and Catalunya has plenty autonomy compared to other communities in Spain.
I am not talking about Palestine, and I do not want to lead this conversation towards talking about Palestine, because the facts are significantly different. Spain did not conquer a country without any defences just for territorial expansion and genocide. Please, do not introduce irrelevant topics.
Should indigenous Americans abandon their claims? No, but completely irrelevant to what we’re talking about.