cross-posted from: https://crazypeople.online/post/14465035
We need Italian an German versions.
The fun thing about this meme is that you can swap capitalism and vanguard communism. And it’s just as true.
Yeah, tankies occupy roughly the same area on the authoritarianism axis of the political compass as fascists and are thus not to be trusted no matter how much you might agree with them on anticapitalism 🤷
Yep, I’d rather agree with someone on liberty, and let socialism prove itself economically. Than agree economically but have to fight for others to be allowed access or liberty.
It is the heart of US policy, ladies and gentlemen, to use fascism to preserve vanguard communism? Huh?
No, vanguard communism uses fascist capitalism as a bogeyman. The same way fascist capitalists use vanguard communism as a bogeyman. As a cover for both their genocides and imperialism.
The meme is correct but ironically funny it works when both subjects are swapped.
I’m not sure if you’re claiming your opponents conflate fascism with democracy or if you yourself do. Pretty standard tankie stuff, explicitly being anti-democracy.
Wow, that’s some spectacular mental gymnastics to avoid getting the point.
It’s not about communism and (not that it matters to the statement but) I’m not a tankie or any other kind of communist.
You could replace “Communism” with “Antifa”, “illegal aliens” or “Liberals making our kids trans” and the point would be the same, since the anticommunism was always an excuse to commit the fascist abuse that they wanted in the first place.
You accuse me of avoidance, yet you refused to clarify. Sounds like I hit the nail on the head.
Personally I think the fascists have actually been quite open about their opposition to democracy. It’s kind of what makes them fascists.
you refused to clarify
Nope, clarify was EXACTLY what I did 🤦
To bend it in neon, though: what the meme, not authored by me, is saying is that fascists are using “protecting democracy” as an excuse to use fascist means to protect capitalism from humanity. I’m pro-democracy and fascists are not. Nor is capitalism.
Sounds like I hit the nail on the head.
“The Nail” is a pretty weird thing to call yourself, but whatever 🤷
You should probably cool it with the self harm though, as your brain is already pretty sluggish without exacerbating it with more blunt trauma.
Please justify your accusation. Because he said nothing whatsoever that conflates those two issues.
Besides, US is not nearly a democratic as it claims. Not by a long shot. If we’re so concerned with saving democracy, for starters we need to abolish the Republic and commit ourselves to democracy in the first place.
we need to abolish the Republic and commit ourselves to democracy in the first place.
that doesn’t make sense at all, these are not complementary opposites, both words mean something completely different, one is form of state and one is form of governing.
-
you have states that are not a republic and are democratic - any modern constituional kingdom: UK, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Netherlands, Japan, Canada, Australia, Spain…)
-
you have republics that are absolutely not a democracy: People’s Republic of China, Islamic Republic of Iran.
-
most states in europe which are not monarchies (but not only there), are democratic republic: United States, Germany, France, Italy, Ireland, Portugal, Austria, Finland, India, Brazil, Mexico, Argentina, Chile, South Africa, South Korea, Indonesia, Philippines
-
and you have states which are neither republic, nor democratic (any despotic kingdom, sultanate, or some type of military junta led countries): Saudi Arabia, Brunei, Oman, Qatar, United Arab Emirates, Eswatini, Vatican City, Burkina Faso, Myanmar…
-
I wanted the user to say clearly that they do not conflate democracy with fascism.
It says “Fascists claim to be saving democracy from communism” and that might initially seem like a benign statement, as is intended, but unfortunately it groups together democracy and fascism and draws a line of separation for communism.
Sadly a very large demographic of people on the fediverse, namely on hexbear, lemmy.ml, lemmygrad, and several conservative instances, believe that the “fascists” does not only apply to people like the GOP, AFD, or Reform UK but rather that all western politicians are a form of fascism and they believe that democracy has failed or never existed to begin with.
It’s kind of like how big tobacco started selling cigarettes to women by branding them as “torches of freedom” during the women’s suffrage movements, by getting people to associate what you want them to buy into with the things that they actually like you play a psychological trick. The opposite is true as well where you can get people to associate things they don’t like, fascism, to the thing you want them to doubt, democracy.
Banjo chill a bit. You’re heavy reaching here. VH said nothing about democracy. Also, you can have democratic communism (not effectively under Leninist) just as democratic capitalism is also technically possible. (just not effectively controlled by fascist capitalists) Honestly this is kind of the point of the meme.
Capitalism has no causation of democracy. They’re totally unrelated.
I think VH’s response speaks well enough for itself.
